Politics

[Malcolm Robinson]

Does this matter?

http://www.thejournal.co.uk/news/north-east-news/candidate-local----both-7550896

[Tonyp]

Malcolm last year I was in Jersey at my union conference,we listened to Anna Turley who is running for Redcar as the labour

candidate in the next general election..basically her speech consisted of how hard the people work up north & how easy people

Have it down south, where she received loud applause & a standing ovation..I wasn't very happy what she said & I told her that I invited

her to come to my district in London & offered to take her to some of the people I represent who work hard....she said to me why

Would I slag the people down south when I'm from there!!! I said exactly so don't do it,she apologised & said sorry,the thing is she's

a cockney.. But she didn't hide the fact it was just the way she was people bashing the south that annoyed me especially when she didn't

Know what she was talking about...

[Malcolm Robinson]

Good God Tonyp, if we stop politicians talking about things they know nothing about there would be enough clean air for everyone!

Being able to get an answer to a specific question would be a good start!

[Brett]

Well malcolm, it's a hard subject to define a specific answer for and you need to take into account lots of different factors.

[Tonyp]

If mr Paxton or Dimberley can't get answer from them,who can?.?the voters can't .....

[Malcolm Robinson]

Brett, is that you breaking out in a rash............politicinitus? LOL.

[threegee]

Hmm.. isn't politics telling people what they want to hear - then when they give you some power you do what you want to do?  Its called representative democracy, obviously because you represent it as democracy, whilst it's certainly not!

 

Well malcolm, it's a hard subject to define a specific answer for and you need to take into account lots of different factors.

 

In fact this is one of the things we discussed at the party conference. / I'm sure you will find a full answer in our manifesto when it's published. / But that's not really the question - the real question is... /  We need a full and frank public debate about this important issue [after which we will do absolutely nothing, again!]* 

 

*delete as appropriate

 

 

P.S. Vote UKIP - the REAL class war is about to begin!

http://www.ukip.org/ukip_scores_by_election_win_in_miliband_s_backyard

[Tonyp]

Ukip is what most people like to hear anybody can be bought even mr Hamilton just give him a big fat brown envelope we could end

Up like the Greeks before they become part of the E.u.! "I've got an idea can I have an envelope ". Is that the people you want to represent you????

[threegee]

Tony, I want people who tell it as it is and don't play politics!  All parties have their hangers-on, and I'd cheerfully submit that the Wallace and Gromit party have more than their fair share!  They certainly had more than their fair share of convicted villains in recent years.

Before you echo the establishment propoganda tell my honestly what you don't agree with here:
 

2.5  The Party is a democratic, libertarian Party and will espouse policies which:

•    promote and encourage those who aspire to improve their personal situation and those who seek to be self-reliant, whilst providing protection for those genuinely in need;
•    favour the ability of individuals to make decisions in respect of themselves;
•    seek to diminish the role of the State;
•    lower the burden of taxation on individuals and businesses;
•    ensure proper control over the United Kingdom's borders;
•    strengthen and guarantee the essential, traditional freedoms and liberties of all people in the United Kingdom.

 

http://www.ukip.org/issues

 

What we have today is not a meritocracy; we have an establishment that's in a cozy duopoly to stitch-up the common man!  It's completely London-centric, and loony liberal to an extent of excluding and positively suppressing what most ordinary people in the rest of the country think and feel.  UKIP is the country's best - indeed only - chance of a popular revolution.

 

If you support Labour, or the Tories, and in particular if you support the LD's, you are against democracy.  That's no more evident than in the inter-party stitch-up to prevent the British people having a say on their own destiny.  Cameron has now broken ranks here in order to save his own skin, but he's not to be trusted with this country's destiny, and will return to his elitist roots. None of your regular parties trust the electorate, indeed they hold ordinary people in contempt.  A lot of people now see this, hence the rise and rise of The People's Army.

[Tonyp]

Threegee,if that's what you believe in that's good to me it just sounds like Nigel is telling you what thatcher told you except

Which one had the balls, would like to know why somebody from bedlington is thinking like you Mmm

[Tonyp]

The peoples army ??.stalin & hitler was like that what did that achieve except there sad dreams of pain & hatred REMEMBER .......

[Maggie/915]

Power corrupts maybe?

Stalin, Hitler, Thatcher, Union leaders etc

We are all on the side of humanity.

We have to respect the views of others even if we know they are wrong and we are right.

Subjective viewpoint not objective!

Once in a position of power people can start to believe their own bushit

[Maggie/915]

Bullshit even if the computer wants another word!!

[Tonyp]

Don't know we're your coming from ukip right wing nazis do think that's right

[Tonyp]

Next you'll be telling me Moseley & his brown shirts was right

[threegee]

Threegee,if that's what you believe in that's good to me it just sounds like Nigel is telling you what thatcher told you except

Which one had the balls, would like to know why somebody from bedlington is thinking like you Mmm

 

There are a lot of Thatcherites in UKIP that's for sure, but there are also a lot of solid working-class and left-leaning people who've seen through the present system.  Sometimes they are both, but sadly not that often hereabouts!  That's hard to explain to people who've been so heavily indoctrinated that MT was evil personified.  The truth is never as plain or simple as most would have you believe, and in a different life MT would be right up there supporting miners - in many ways she did.  She also had a deep distrust of snake oil political types, and was a real conviction politician - sadly lacking nowadays!  Don't you think it's strange that both Blair and Brown at one time or another have claimed to be her true heir?  How do you rationalise that one?

 

It's a real pity that many in our local community are still fighting a battle that long since ended.  The real enemy is the London-centric liberal (with a small L) elites, who produce nowt, but think they have a divine right to rule.  There are just as many of these in Labour as the Tories, and they are hand in glove with each other!  The whole thing is like one of those carefully scripted wrestling matches; anyone with any sense knows it's all pre-arranged, and in awkward places even carefully rehearsed, but people still buy into the idea that it's a genuine contest.

Ummm..  it's going to surprise you how many people from Bedlington are thinking like me - and sadly the rest aren't thinking!

 

Maggie it's great to have your input, but you've got things standing on their head.  If we go on at the present rate the Germans are going to drag us into their Fourth Reich.  There are already moves afoot for an EU army, and in the "post democratic" superstate that's intended, you can bet that WWIII will eventually result. As you say power corrupts, and you have to look no further than the USA to see how easy it is for a few nutty military types to drag hundreds of millions of otherwise peaceful people into a disastrous war - and in situations where none of their own interests are directly threatened, and where none of their own territory is at risk.  Just look at Crimea in recent months to imagine what would be made of that by a European superstate.  UKIPs policy there is to leave well alone; bringing Ukraine into the EU is destabilising and can only stoke conflict.  The Russians quite rightly see this as a land grab by traditional enemies, and feel justified in helping their compatriots by the same sorts of devious means that the US and EU has been helping to stoke up the problem in the first instance.  UKIP is the only party that says this is none of our business, and we shouldn't be meddling.

 

The present situation would have been unimaginable to our parents, and their parents generations.  As we commemorate the centenary of that first disastrous war, we should try to imagine what they'd want to tell us from their graves!  It would surely be don't trust the Germans and their ambitions, and don't let it happen all over again!  It's not your everyday German citizen we should be wary of, but expansionism is in the psyche and it repeatedly takes hold of individuals in power.  What on earth is the EU if it isn't yet another manifestation of this?  We can trade perfectly happily without customs barriers with none of the superstate BS!  But (just like with the Common Market / European Union deception already perpetrated on us) there's a hidden agenda, and when it becomes obvious to all it will be far too late.

 

Look at the four main party leaders and ask yourself which one is doing it because he feels a genuine concern for his country and which ones are there simply for self-advancement and raw power.  Nigel has already stood down once, and when he achieves his transparent goal he'll step down.  He's not after power; he simply wants to break the mould, and then have a peaceful life at the pub or on the golf course.  His man-of-the-people persona is not assumed to get votes, he actually is one of us, and like us totally p'd off with the system!  That's why the establishment has no answers, and why they will try every trick in the book to cling onto power.  Don't buy any of it!  You have been - and are allowing yourself to be - hoodwinked by people who actually consider themselves to be smarter than you.  It suits the establishment to keep our town in poverty, and, if you continue to vote for an establishment party, that is exactly where it is going to stay!

 

Think Salvation Army not military army - with the emphasis on salvation!

[Tonyp]

Had a few drinks so I'll digest your thoughts & reply tomorrow you must remember Nigel's wife is a German but is that ok cos she married Nigel by the way the only union who is freighting the Tories is the railway union,bob Crowe true Geordie beliefs .......

[Malcolm Robinson]

"The real enemy is the London-centric liberal (with a small L) elites, who produce nowt, but think they have a divine right to rule.”

………...............................................................................................................................................................propped up by a despotic political system which uses nepotism and coercion to further its own autosarcophagical goals at the expense of democracy. This you can see at every level of government from the lowest to the very highest office in the land.

The perfidy exercised against the common good in pursuit of hegemony is more than apparent and any nascent opposition to that has to be welcomed, irrespective of past indiscretions of some of the initial make up, almost in a deontological kind of way!

The whole thing is an exercise in Pournelle's Iron Law of Bureaucracy!

[Adam Hogg]

Don't you think it's strange that both Blair and Brown at one time or another have claimed to be her true heir?  How do you rationalise that one?

I can't remember at any time Brown saying he was the true heir to Thatcher!

He always said he was more a traditional labour politician.

Also if he was the true heir to Thatcher why did he have the east coast mainline nationalised? (Also it is the only real profit making rail franchise running)

I have said it once and will say it a thousand times more I had not love of Tony Blair, he was a wolf in sheep's clothes.

On the point of UKIP do you think they would do anything the public wanted once they got into power?

 

All Political parties are the same and have there own agendas:

Tories make as much money for their friends and party members as they can

Labour make the unions happy.

Lib Dems have an agenda of screwing up the county as much as they can with stupid ideas like joining the Euro.

BNP want to kick everyone who is no white and speaks English out the county.

Greens want to make the UK the worlds biggest windfarm (as long as it is not on their doorstep)

UKIP don't even want to know what there personal agenda is!

 

The only real way to get change is to have independent local people fighting for the people of the area, as they have no political preference and no party whip to make them vote the way of the party.

[threegee]

I can't remember at any time Brown saying he was the true heir to Thatcher!

He always said he was more a traditional labour politician.

...

 

No you weren't meant to hear that, it was not for a traditional (old) Labour audience.  He let other people put the actual word around, including Tony - but that's the image he carefully cultivated for southern audiences.

 

 

 

 

 

 

...

 

UKIP don't even want to know what there personal agenda is!

 

The only real way to get change is to have independent local people fighting for the people of the area, as they have no political preference and no party whip to make them vote the way of the party.

 

That's because they don't have one!  They do have real policies for real reform though, if you care to read them.

 

http://www.ukip.org/issues

 

You are dead wrong Adam!  Yes, local people like you can help, but real and lasting change needs to come at the national level.  Malcolm is spot on in his diagnosis of why things don't happen here.  We can all see what is needed, but there's absolutely no reason why establishment politicians should deliver, or ever will deliver.  That's unless they are shocked into action in the same way that pro-EU Cameron has been shocked by UKIP already.  Labour too can be shocked into real action, but even the slightest chance of a UKIP win is the only way that is ever going to happen here.  So... whichever way you look at things, and whichever direction you are coming from, the only chance for real and lasting change is to support UKIP.

 

BTW you can't simply dismiss ten disastrous years and a wrecked economy by saying "Tony Blair, he was a wolf in sheep's clothes.".  When you vote Labour that's exactly what you get.  Old Labour long since worked out that it was unelectable.  Only a few tame dinosaurs (like our Ian) are kept on to maintain the pretence that they are "for the workers". Maybe they are for the workers, but they're certainly not British workers, or anyone you know!

[Tonyp]

Thatchers dementia must have really hit her then, she probably thought she was getting her picture took with Dennis instead of

Good old Gordon,by the way we don't take money off our union members towards the Labour Party fund it is up to them...

[threegee]

A bit cruel Tony; it can come to us all, and shouldn't diminish what we've actually achieved in our lives.  Ronnie R ended up a bit "forgetful" too, but it in no way diminishes that he was one of the very best presidents; one who (by actually confronting the problem head-on) ended the cold war and made the World a safer place for us all.  Anyway, what's to the point is that Gordon never missed an opportunity to be seen as heir to the MT legacy - he left plenty more clues for the history books!

 

...we don't take money off our union members towards the Labour Party fund it is up to them...

 

That sounds very healthy.  And, I think that your late Bob Crow was one of the better trade unionists.  He did what he had to do for his members, and never dragged them in to a conflict where the odds weren't greatly on their side.  A latter-day Mick McGahey I'd imagine!  That's quite unlike.. ummm.. you know who!

[Malcolm Robinson]

Relatively new occurrence that Tonyp.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23257182

[Tonyp]

Malcolm , Mike McGaheys nephew & his missus is vary good friends with me & Cathy,nothing to do with politics!but he's a nice guy

Kind & generous ...

[Tonyp]

Malcolm, I'm with the community union used to be I.s.t.c but we joined ranks with other unions,to become community, if you go

To our website you'll see who we represent,quite a diverse bunch.. On a lighter note you'll be able to see me in the news archive

set... L.o.l