Canny lass

I'm not quite sure what your message is there, Malcolm. Are you saying that children prefer TV and video games to going out? If so, why all the fuss about a leisure centre for youngsters?

Or perhaps you are saying that parents just want a quiet night and the child has no choice about going out?

On 08/11/2021 at 21:48, _pauls said:

I appreciate what you are saying that not every town will have every facility, and small villages will always rely on nearby towns for some things, but Bedlington is not a small village. Bedlington is larger than Morpeth, Alnwick, Hexham, Berwick or Amble. Think about the facilities these places have and think about what Bedlington has. Think about how much council tax we are paying in to the coffers of the council and think about what we are getting in return.

The fact is that towns the size of Bedlington across the county (and the country as a whole) do have local facilities like leisure centres, cinemas, theatres, museums etc in fact I suspect that each of the towns I listed above has most or all of these facilities while we have none of them.

Comparing the 1950s to the 2020s is a little misleading. I grew up in the 1970s and that was a different world with a fraction of the traffic and less petty crime and violence so as a 10-12 yr old I'd think nothing of cycling 5 miles to the nearest "bigger" towns for the cinema or the amusement arcades, with little fear of getting knocked off my bike or having it nicked. Plus few kids in those days grew up in households where both parents worked full time so there was more scope for parents to take them to facilities that were further afield. You can argue that life was simpler, happier and fitter back then but the world is a very different place and it is far more relevant to compare Bedlington of 2021 to Morpeth or Blyth of 2021 than to Netherton of 1950.

The key for me is independence - as a kid I had access to facilities that were further afield because it was easier and safer to get around than it is today. The same applies to people of all ages for who transport is not affordable or easy.

If the argument is "why can't people travel to use facilities?" then I'm not quite sure why this argument only applies to Bedlington and not Blyth, Morpeth, Cramlington and Ashington when it comes to swimming baths for example.

As I say I don't mean to be disrespectful of other opinions but this is of material impact on the lives and livelihoods of the people of Bedlington and while it may be of interest to those who may once of lived here but now reside elsewhere it will have little or no impact on their lives.

It is a little like the fable of the chicken and the pig

I see where you are coming from Pauls but before I get into the discussion on Sports and Leisure facilities let me just ask, am I right in thinking that you believe ” there was more scope for parents to take them [children] to facilities that were further afield” because ”few kids in those days grew up in households where both parents worked full time”? My father , like those of my peers, was a miner working 8-9 hour shifts, 6 days a week, 2 weeks holiday and five bank holidays off. My mother on the other hand, also like those of my peers, was a housewife working 16 hour shifts, 7 days a week, no holidays or bankholidays off. In Netherton, and I imagine Bedlington, this seemed to be the rule rather than the exception to it. So my experience was that every child grew up with two parents working MORE than full time compared to today’s standards. OK, we may have had one parent working at home, without a wage of course, but that didn’t give either parent more time than the parents of today. In fact, I would argue to the contrary.

My married life and, I suspect, yours became infinitely easier than my mother’s with the availability of:

washing machine/tumble dryer instead of red raw hands and a mangle in the back yard

vaccuum cleaner instead of brush, shovel and carpet beater

late-night supermarkets instead of a bus journey to Bedlington while the kids were at school

fridge/freezer instead of almost daily shopping trips

sewing machine to mend clothes and household linnen – not that I bothered much with the latter, the era of ’just throw it away and buy new’ was just beginning.

no garden/allotment of any necessity (vegetables) to tend to instead of a garden for relaxing

pre-fabricated meals and take-away meals, instead of home-cooked, should the need/urge arise

gas/electric cooker instead of coal-fired kitchen range requiring endless carrying of coal

central heating instead of above-mentioned kitchen range

electric food mixer instead of a wooden spoon

in-house, running, hot and cold water instead of a cold water street tap – one to every 8 houses.

own transport (other than bike, which wasn’t available to my mother either)

shorter working hours and 2 days off

and, as if all that time saved wasn’t enough,

two wages coming in instead of one.

Given that, it seems reasonable to believe that time and money ought to be more abundant now than in the 50s and if not, perhaps we should be asking ourselves why not. Perhaps today we have different priorities for the use of our time and money and that certainly is open to comparison. I feel, rightly or wrongly, that if two parents work outside the home then that is their choice and no-one else’s. They alone have made the decision that they have the time to do so without detracting from the quality of the family life they wish for. Likewise it is their choice as to what they spend their earnings on.

However, given the above comparison of life in the 50s and life today, it leaves me wondering how my parents could find the time and money, to take their children on an outing involving a bus ride, once a week to the playground park at Beech Grove or to the ’Picnic Field’ as we then called Atlee park, while parents today feel that they can not? For my parents, it most certainly involved making sacrifices to be able to prioritise time and money for that purpose. I’m sure my father would have preferred being at home listening to a football match on the radio on Saturday afternoon and my mother would most certainly have liked to get into bed before 1am the day before instead having to stay up and prepare the dinner for the next day so that we could get out. For us, the children, it involved learning that we couldn’t have everything we asked for and that waiting was part of life.

Big round of applause from me, Andy and Eggy  - and Maggie for the first photos in what i think can be a great album.

1 hour ago, Malcolm Robinson said:

I agree........I firmly believe we have Olympic champions who have never had the chance to try the activities they would excell in!  

With all due respect, Malcolm. You are one of the most hard-working and caring councillors I've ever come across and I appreciate that you give many hours of your time and energy fighting for improvements to our beloved home town but ...

.. there are Olympic champions across the world who haven't ever had a pair of running shoes, never mind a sporting facility to train in. It requires a bit more than that. It requires passion, dedication, a will to succeed and possibly an adult or two to support and encourage and maybe cheer you on along the way. If you have that  you don't need the luxury of a sporting facility - as several great athletes have shown us through the years.

1 hour ago, _pauls said:

No disrespect intended but that is very easy to say if you don't live in the town.

We moved to the town 12 years ago with a 3 year old daughter. She is now taking her GCSEs, A levels next year and then hopefully away for University. She has grown up in a town with virtually no leisure facilities other than a couple of playing fields. I really do hope we will get something other than retail and apartments - something like the announcement last year for example - but she will have her bags packed and will have left the town before the ribbon is cut to open it.

That is a crying shame for a generation to grow up and leave the area having never had a fraction of the opportunities afforded to the kids of Blyth, Cramlington, Morpeth, Ashington etc.

I'm sorry but a whole generation of kids shouldn't have had to wait.

No disrespect taken, Pauls and no disrespect intended in what I am about to say. I grew up in Netherton, in the 50s, which also had no 'council provided', leisure facilities and had only ONE playing field. It didn't have a library, butcher's, baker's, supermarket, hairdressers, clothing outlet or health centre either. For all of those amenities my caring parents had to take me on a bus-ride to the nearest town - Bedlington. It didn't have any leisure facilities then  either, other than a cinema, Humford Baths and the Hapenny Woods. Humford Baths, nearest thing to a leisure centre then, was a luxury my parents couldn't afford but there was, and still is, a river on its doorstep. That's where I learned to swim. There was no gym either but the Hapenny Woods was a good substitute on a family day out with a picnic thrown in for good measure. The lack of 'council provided' facilities didn't do me, or any of my schoolmates, any harm. On the contrary I think we were fitter, more social, and perhaps better prepared for adulthood than today's children.

I returned to Bedlington in the late 80s and lo and behold there were 'Leisure Centres' in Blyth and Cramlington. There was also a good bus service so it wasn't as though I needed to travel to the ends of the earth if I wanted chlorinated water to swim in, a wall to climb on or a place to meet friends.

You are abviously a caring parent too and clearly have the best interests of your child at heart. Has it really been more of a struggle for you than for my parents, to provide meaningful leisure activities for your daughter simply because what you want for her doesn't exist in Bedlington? I know from my visits that the bus service is infinitely better than when I was a child and maybe you have the luxury of a car?

Like you, I'm not hoping for more retail and apartments but there again, anything would be better than it is today. What I'm hoping for is something that attracts visitors and their hard earned money to Bedlington which may eventually initiate even further development of Bedlington.  Unfortunately I don't think a leisure centre is going to do that. Most towns in the immediate vicinity already have one and I get the impression that parents don't seem to want to  take a bus/car journey away from their home town today.

Everything comes to those who wait!

Separate entry would be great from a research point of view.

"You must have ptience Grasshopper". (With apologies to KungFu).

21 hours ago, Alan Edgar (Eggy1948) said:

@Canny lass & @Maggie/915 - I haven't created an album yet as I have been out of action all week and I am off to bed now for a rest. Hopefully back at the PC this afternoon and i will get one done.

I see the album is now created so I'm assuming that you are 'back in action' already. I hope that whatever was ailing you is under control. Take it easy and listen to your body, because your body always knows best. When it says "rest" it means just that.

When you feel like it, do you think that the stones in this topic could be copied to the new album together with the names on them? It would be a fantastic research material.

Posting very early today as I'm not sure I'll get time later. Busy day ahead!

This week's quiz:

1. What sort of creature is a Greenshank?

2. At what weight did Cassius Clay win his 1960 Olympic boxing title?

3. Honeydew and Cantaloupe are varieties of what?

4. Which lake is surrounded by Kenya, Uganda and Tanzania?

5. What is the last book of the Old Testament?

6. Which British scientist discovered benzene?

7. USA launched its first space-shuttle in 1981. What was it called?

8. By what name is Agnes Gonxha Bejaxhui better known?

9. Which metal is represented by the symbol Cs?

10. Who sailed away to die on HMS Bellerophon?

11. Which planet is nearest the sun?

12. Who succeeded Henry VIII as monarch?

I’ll bet you didn’t know ….

In Sienna, Italy, there is a law which forbids any woman christened Mary to ever work as a prostitute.

Answers on Thursday as usual.

Thanks James! I'd forgotten about the 39 register. I don't suppose you know which year the shop closed down?

The Smail family continued:

A business is born ...

Isabella’s residence address in 1871 is given as ”Grocers shop” ”Front Street” and Isabella’s occupation is given as ”Grocer & Provision Dealer”. Isabella is now a businesswoman and the family is clearly living over the shop where they even have room enough to accomodate a boarder. Even his occupation is given as ”Grocer” and he may be employed by Isabella. I notice that even the 17 year old son of the next door neighbour is working as a ”grocer’s apprentice” and could also be employed by her, in which case things seem to be going well for Isabella whose social ranking has now progressed from employee to employer.

Ten years later in April 1881 only Isabella and John Robert are recorded at the address. Isabella is now 52 years old and her son John Robert is 23 and still single. He has followed his mother into the grocery and provisions business but no mention is made of his sister Dorothy Ann. I can’t find her either working- or visiting away from home in the census. However, she does reappear at the address in 1891.

Prior to this however, on 10 APR 1888, Isabella dies,aged 59 years and it is her headstone on the photo which Maggie posted above. It’s quite an elegant stone, with a lot of detail in the design which is in strong contrast to that of her parents, reflecting perhaps the progress made from her humble beginnings as a nursery maid to successful Bedlington businesswoman.

In 1891, following Isabella’s death, John Robert 33 yo is still living at the same adress. He is still running the grocer’s shop and is now head of the household. His sister, Dorothy Ann 30 yo, has returned but appears not to have any occupation. However, they now have a resident domestic servant, 17 year old, Bedlington born, Lily Whitfield a further sign of the family’s increasing social status.

In 1901 Dorothy Ann, 40 years old and as yet unmarried, and John Robert, now 43 and still in the grocery business continue to reside above the shop. Only John Robert is working and they no longer have a servant. However, there is a new family member because John Robert has finally married. I can see from his marriage record that he married at the age of 41 to Jane Isabella Grey, 14 years his younger, in the first half of 1899 in the village of Rothbury, Northumberland. They do not appear to have any children at this time.

First in 1911 can we see Dorothy Ann working. She is still living with her brother and she appears to have joined him working in the business and the family once again has a servant – 20 year old Mary Ann Elizabeth Dixon of Sleekburn. That, however, is not the only change in circumstances. John Robert and Jane Isabella now have a family of four children ranging in age from 1 to 8:

Isabella Smail born abt. 1903. Died 26 SEP 1994 aged 92. Isabella died as Smail and seemingly never married.

Edwin Smail born abt. 1904. Died 20 JAN 1982 aged 78 years. I can find no record of any marriage. He is buried in Bedlington together with his sister Isabella. It is their headstone we see above, posted by James.

Catherine Dorothy Smail born abt- 1910. Died 1990. She also died as Smail and appears not to have married.

The above three children all appear to have joined their father in the grocery business. James tells us that all three were working in the shop in the 1950s.

The fourth child, George Grey Smail born 17SEP 1905 died 2 MAR 1969, was a well educated man and was admitted 1930 as graduate B.Sc. to the List of Electrical Engineers in Hebburn on Tyne. In 1939 he was living and working in Guildford as ”Assistant engineer (Technical) and the following year married Adeline Beethem in Wellingborough, Northamptonshire. He appears to have later moved to Scotland, where he died, and is remembered on his grandmother’s headstone in Bedlington.

With no available census records after 1911 it is impossible to say if the unmarried children of John Robert and Jane Isabell Smail continued to live together above the business started by their grandmother. The house was certainly big enough. The 1911 census describes it as having 7 rooms all, or at least most, of them would have been above the shop. Could it be possible that the Smail family now owned both parts of the building?

I wonder if Isabella Smail was the first businesswomanof any rank in Bedlington? She was certainly a tough woman. I'm impressed.

Answers to last week's Halloween Special:

1.Count Wampyr (Stoker's initial plans for Dracula markedly differ from the final novel. Had Stoker completed his original plans, a German professor called Max Windshoeffel "would have confronted Count Wampyr from Styria") https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dracula.

2. The Puritan Pilgrims

3. Wet sheets

4. Samhain, All Hallow’s Eve, The Feast of the Dead

5. Monster Mash

6. A coven

7. All Hallow’s Eve

8. Red eyes

9. Rumania

10. Mary Shelley

11. Samana or Herne the Hunter

12. Saint

13. Vines

14. Any thing from the first four lines of verse:
”Eye of newt and toe of frog,
Wool of bat and tongue of dog,
Adder’s fork and blind-worm’s sting,
Lizard’s leg and owlet’s wing,
For a charm of powerful trouble,
Like a hell-broth boil and bubble.”

15. Long-legged beasties

16. Scream

17. The fairies might steal you away.

18. Ghost Town

19. A witch

20. Celts

New quiz tomorrow.

2 hours ago, Bedlingtonian said:

The archives at Woodhorn have a list of pre 1852 monumental inscriptions of St Cuthbert's Church by J. Jewitt in 1977. 

It contains all gravestones and plaques bearing an inscription dated 1851 or earlier. No photographs unfortunately. 

Sounds good, but I think a picture gives so much more information about the deceased. Symbols and ornamentation, for instance, can give clues about  the economic and social status of the deceased. Do you know if the Woodhorn list can be researched online?

... continuing the history of the Smail family:

According to the 1871 census, Isabella Smail and her two children are now living in Bedlington but I am unable to ascertain when they returned. I can, however, see from the death register for England and Wales that her parents were still alive at the time of her husband’s death in September 1862. I can also see that Isabella’s grieving had barely begun when her father, Robert Fish, also passed away in January 1863 barely 3 months after the death of her husband.

It was perhaps in connection with her father’s death that Isabella returned to Bedlington, possibly to assist her widowed mother, Dorothy Fish (born Dorothy Kirkup). It is also a possibility that, should Isabella and her husband Edwin have been living in a tied cottage in Chatton, she and the children were obliged to find other accomodation upon his death. Sadly, even Isabella’s mother died a few years later, in October 1869, and she is buried alongside her husband in St Cuthbert´s Churchyard Bedlington. Their grave is marked by the simplest of headstones.

That headstone is interesting in that it is engraved on both sides. The east-facing side, shown above, records the deaths of Isabella’s parents while the west-facing side documents the deaths of ten members of the Kirkup family – Isabella’s mother’s side of the family (no photo available on Findagrave, only text, perhaps a project for one of our photo enthusiasts?).

It seems, that by the time of the 1871 census, only Isabella, now 42 years old, and the two children, aged 10 and 13 years, were left in Bedlington and I find them living in the east end on the north side of Front Street. At first I thought they might be living in the former first home of her parents, three doors down from the entrance to Colliery Row, but comparing maps and census records showed that they were living further down the street towards Bedlington Bank in what appears to be a relatively new building occupying land between Bell’s Place and Hollymount – shown here as undeveloped, a few years earlier in 1866:

The next most recent map with any detail, dated 1897, shows the same area developed, with left to right: A semi-detached property comprising two dwellings, the Oddfellows Arms public house and behind them the new East End School followed by a further semi-detached property of which the left hand property was occupied by the Smail family. The census of 1871 shows that this was the layout even then. It also shows that the property adjoining Isabella’s was divided into two dwellings with entrances facing Hollymount and thus named ”Hollymount” rather than Front Street.

As mentioned earlier, Isabella’s mother had died just 18 months prior to the census of 1871 and that census makes no mention of Fish’s Yard. The buildings are still there, as evidenced by the census schedule numbers. But the adress is now simply ”Front Street”. Possibly Dorothy Smail, following her husband’s death, has sold the properties and moved back to the north side of the street, maybe together with her daughter living in. More probable, in view of Dorothy’s advancing years, is that Isabella may have inherited her parents, sold the properties and invested in the new development on the north side.

To be continued ...

Can anybody tell me what "boxings" and "sharps" are?

Thanks for your input, Vic. I'm sure Eggy will work his usual magic!

2 hours ago, James said:

What you can’t see on the photo is the last inscription on the headstone that was for Catherine who died in 1990.

Would that be Catherine Dorothy, daughter of John Robert Smail, born about 1911?

2 hours ago, James said:

ohn Robert and according to the headstone posted by Maggie, he was the organist for over 50 years

Thanks for confirming that, James! Nice to know that my linguistic skills haven't rusted away completely. It's  a real pleasure tracing the family's roots and following Isabella's journey through life. I'm impressed by the sheer toughness the woman had in making it alone after her husband's death. Today I've started plotting her time in Bedlington after her return from Chatton. If you have any more information about the family I'd love to hear it.

16 hours ago, Canny lass said:

Eggy, let me have a think about that and i'll get back to you tomorrow.

Hi Eggy! I needed a bit of time to have a play around in the gallery before replying.

I had a look around the gallery to see if there was any format that was useful and I think that the format you’ve used in creating the school albums could also work well here. Using the gallery album ”Bedlingtonshire Community High School” as an example the new album name could be ’St Cuthbert’s Churchyard, headstones’. Then each photo could have a file name that is the name of the deceased, in the same way the school photos are named, or the family name, if there are several memorials on one stone.

Really, when I suggested an album my main idea was to preserve the stones of Bedlington together in digital form, before the original texts are weathered away. completely They are a valuable source of information for researchers. I wasn’t thinking that we should be providing information about the meaning of symbols etc. There are plenty of sites on Internet doing that already. Of course, should any such information pop up in the discussion related to each photo then that would be a point of interest, specific to that particular photo.

Your system with school photos works well when searching for a particular person. I typed in Nicola Downey and was redirected to the first photo in the album immediately. Once in the album you have created some basic information on the High School (to the left of the screen). That would also work well for the planned album butI think it might be wise to keep the album and file titles simple, Album: Name of churchyard – File:Name of person/family. It makes searching so much easier.

What do other members think)

The Smail family continued ...

Who was isabella Fish?

Given that Edwin and Isabella were married 1851 in Hexham and their children born in Chatton during the following decade, I started my search for Isabella in the 1851 census for that area and found her, without problem, living only a few miles away from the above mentioned Sandhoe Hall. Like Edwin, Isabella is also working for the landed gentry.

The 1851 census shows Isabella, 23 years old and as yet unmarried, residing at Beaufront Hall (now Beaufront Castle) near Hexham, where she is employed as one of two nursery maids to the children of Lady Mary Cuthbert, daughter-in-law to the owner of Beaufront Hall – Magistrate William Cuthbert. There is, in fact, a strong link between the two estates of Sandhoe and Beaufront, Beaufront having earlier been owned by the aforementioned Errington family.

When Beaufront heiress, Dorothy Carnaby, married Gilbert Errington in the 16th century the Errington’s later built a new house - possibly Sandhoe but I havent researched it. Beaufront was then sold to the Cuthbert family in the early part of the 19th century.

Coincidence it may be but the 1851 owner of Beaufront Hall, Magistrate William Cuthbert, Elizabeth’s employer, also became Sheriff of Northumberland in1860 as did Edwin’s employer in 1855. Given the close proximity of the two estates and the relationship between them it is not surprising that the couple met and married in the Hexham area.

Returning attention to Isabella, we can see from the 1851 census returns, that she was not a native of Hexham. Her place of birth is clearly given as ”Durham, Bedlington”. At that time Bedlington, as we know it, belonged to the historic palatine (county) of Durham and is recorded as such, rather than Northumberland. As England’s gentry are not known for employing the hoi poloi of society in posts involving the care and uppbringing of their heirs it would seem that Isabella may not have her roots among those of the lowest social standing in the shire. So, who was she?

Isabella Fish, as she was born, was the daughter of Robert and Dorothy Fish who can be found as early as 1841 – the date of the first census – resident in Bedlington at an adress given simply as ”High Street”. Very few houses then had either name or number but I can see from the enumerator’s description of his area that the adress is situated at the East end of the town; ”all that part of the township [ … ] that lies to the east of Leadgate and Half Closes, on the north and south sides of the town of Bedlington including Hirst Head, Staith, Iron Works, Millbank and Bank House”. Also, by tracing the enumerators route, I can see that the Smail family are living on the north side of what what we now call East End. Just a few doors away, towards Bedlington bank, is a public house (not named) which may be the Oddfellow’s Arms , should this be so, then the family could already be living in what became Smail’s Ironmongers shop.

Robert and Dorothy are then 59 and 54 years old and Robert’s occupation is given as ”Carrier”. There are three children living at home: Robert aged 18 who, like his father, is also employed as a carrier, Dorothy 16 years without occupation, and Isabella, then 13 years old.

Ten years later we know that Isabella is working and residing in Hexham and we can see from the census of 1851 that even her older brother and sister have flown the nest in Bedlington. Only their parents, Robert and Dorothy are registered at what appears to be the same adress. Robert is now 69 and his wife is 64. Robert’s occupation has changed. He is no longer recorded as ”carrier”. Instead, his occupation is recorded as ”House Proprietor” suggesting that the family do not belong to any particularly low social class. The thought occurs to me that Robert Fish may already in 1841 have been running a buisiness from the house on Front Street east which later became the ironmonger’s shop.

In the1861 census, the High Street is now being referred to as ”Main Street” and Robert and Dorothy’s adress is given as ”Fish’s Yard”, presumably taking it’s name from the owner. The Yard consists of three dwellings, of which one is occupied by Robert and Dorothy Fish. Robert’s occupation is again recorded as ”Proprietor of Houses”. However, the couple would appear to have moved from the north side of the street to the south as the north side is not included in the enumerators description of his area. Fish’s Yard is situated between Mill Yard at the east end of Main Street and the Vicarage of St Cuthbert’s Church, though somewhat nearer to Mill Yard than to the vicarage.

The next stage in my research leads me to believe that, at some point between Edwin’s death in 1862 and April 1871 Isabella and the children return to Bedlington possibly to live with, or to be nearer to, her parents or, perhaps, to inherit them.

More about that tomorrow.

Eggy, let me have a think about that and i'll get back to you tomorrow.

I think we can forget about the bible in relation to the Smail family. What mother would spell her own - and her daughter's - surname incorrectly.

Vic, would you like to have another look at your answers. There are 20 questions and I think you' may have missed nr 15,  which means that your answers 15 - 19 may be the answers to 16 - 20.

3 hours ago, Alan Edgar (Eggy1948) said:

I’ll bet you didn’t know ….

A game of Quidditch uses four balls in total: 1 Quaffle, 2 Bludgers and 1 Golden Snitch.

Answer  = I didn’t – I’ve never watched a Harry Potter movie

Well, if you can drag yourself away from action and sex they are good movies! The grandbairns would probably love them.