suffragettes Emily Wilding Davison

[Maggie/915]

She died 100 years ago this year.

People must be related to her.

The church yard in Morpeth has her grave.

She gave her life for a cause she believed in.

[keith lockey]

Sorry, Maggie, I know this is going to look as if we are locking horns again but did you know the jockey of the horse, Anmer, that hit Emily Davison committed suicide after suffering nightmares.

SEE ARTICLE BELOW.

She died four days later in Epsom Cottage Hospital, due to a fractured skull and internal injuries caused by the incident. Herbert Jones, the jockey who was riding the horse, suffered a mild concussion in the incident, but was "haunted by that poor woman's face" for much longer. In 1928, at the funeral of Emmeline Pankhurst, Jones laid a wreath "to do honour to the memory of Mrs Pankhurst and Miss Emily Davison". In 1951, his son found Herbert Jones dead in a gas-filled kitchen, having committed suicide.^[11]

The horse, Anmer, having gone over, got to his feet and completed the race minus his jockey.

Edited January 30, 2013 by keith lockey

[Maggie/915]

Not at all Keith.

There is an argument that she did not intend to die and had a return ticket.

Either way suicide or accident.

People suffer.

Was it for the greater good?

Horrible things were happening to these ladies.

[Maggie/915]

This lady also hid in a broom cupboard in the Houses of Parliament. Then she could say her residence for the census was Parliament even though she could not vote.

Tony Benn has put a plaque on the back of the door.

Several people in the area have said they were related to this lady.

This year is important.

Inspirational, to fight for a cause that you believe in and to die.

Her grave in Morpeth says just that.

Sad that the jockey suffered but interesting that he paid tribute to her.

[Malcolm Robinson]

We took my gravely ill father in law to the commemorative service at Morpeth a few years ago.

My wife attends all of them now.

Some inspirational women of today talking at these services!

[Symptoms]

Keith wrote: "...committed suicide after suffering nightmares." He'd be arrested for that these days

Seriously though, perhaps the reason why Emily is such an inspirational figure to many of us is because her action was caught on film. We can access the event and bear witness unlike many other important historical figures and events.

[keith lockey]

The jury is out with me and Emily Davison. I mean how can anyone inspire people by jumping in front of a horse!!!

I would have been more inspired if she had become the first female jockey and rode Anmer to victory. Now that would have been one in the cap for the sufragettes!

[Symptoms]

Come on Keith, "I would have been more inspired if she had become the first female jockey and rode Anmer to victory. Now that would have been one in the cap for the sufragettes!" ... she would never have been allowed to by the old buffers in charge. The action was clearly a protest that went wrong for her but became iconic for her cause.

Protest movements around the world are littered with martyrs to the cause: just a few local ones ... the Tolpuddle guys, and in recent times - Blair Peach, Bobby Sands, Francis Hughes, Raymond McCreesh, Patsy O'Hara, Joe McDonnell, Martin Hurson, Kevin Lynch, Kieran Doherty, Thomas McElwee, Michael Devine.

The lists are endless ....

[keith lockey]

Okay, look at it this way. What was she trying to do that day? Draw attention to the plight of females and the fact that they wanted the vote. (I'm simplifying things here.) Would it not have been better if Em and her cohorts had obtained a horse. (Don't say security would have stopped her because she managed to just walk onto the track.) So she obtains a horse and rides it in the race.

1) She shows the capability and resourcefulness of women in doing so.

2) She become a figurehead and highlights the Sufragette's cause.

3) She makes all the newspapers who take up the plight of women.

4) No one gets hurt!

5) Hollywood makes a film of the event years later with Meryl Streep as Emily Davison.

And no, I'm not being flipant. There are martyrs who die for a cause and earnest believers who make a point and carry on promoting it. (There is no evidence that says Em planned on suicide is there?)

Edited February 7, 2013 by keith lockey

[Symptoms]

Keith, I agree that "(There is no evidence that says Em planned on suicide is there?)" hence my comment "The action was clearly a protest that went wrong for her ..." .

I think her action was designed to stop, or at least hinder, the King's nag ... oh what a sensation that would have been on it's own with the fantastic publicity that would have followed. It would have had the added bonus that she would have lived to see it. You're not being flippant with your achievement list as I think all can be ticked-off as done bar the hurt/croaking one; that one, in my book, gets her placed firmly in the glorious martyrdom group. I did see a film years ago about this story but Meryl wasn't in it.

[keith lockey]

Footage of the incident that I saw online said that there was no way she could have seen if it was the King's horse she was jumping in front of. (Because of the bend and crowd.) The footage is grainy and not very good so I don't know about that. I am not demeaning the whole affair; my argument is there was tons of other alternative gestures she could have made. She and her friends could have ran across the track with a banner and stopped the whole race; they could have paraded down the track like they do at Ascot (?) To me the Emily Davison incident is like jumping in front of a bus because Arriva is going to change the route and not go by your street anymore - yes you might make a point but if it is going to kill you its a bit of a Pyrrhic victory.

[Maggie/915]

We need to remember the other details.

The suffragettes were persecuted for simply wanting a vote for a democratic government to represent them.

Without people like Emily who made a stand for others where would we all be!

Okay maybe it was just votes for women but it was unfair, I do not believe she wanted to die or traumatise the jockey. She wanted justice. Surely that is not to hard to understand.

We would all fight for a cause we believed in.

We would all fight against injustice.

Social responsibility means standing up and being counted.

Surely that is not to difficult to understand even if you disagree.

Sincerely held views are understood by all.

[Maggie/915]

Suggest you read about the 'cat and mouse policy'

Force feeding and punishment was extreme.

We could mention the unfairness of the miners

strike, or loads of other incidents where people were forced to take a stand.

Jumping in front of an Arriva bus is a crazy example by anyone's standards.

[keith lockey]

Maggie, you talk about We would all fight against injustice and Social responsibility means standing up and being counted.

Then you say my Arriiva bus example is crazy.

Well I knew people whose very livelihoods were put at risk through bus changes - they could no longer get to work. I think that comes under injustice and social responsibility.

But let's look at scenarios. What if someone had ran out to try to stop Emily Davison that fatal day - and in doing so got killed. What if that jockey had died - and left a wife and children. Now that latter scenario would have been ironic. A widowed woman bringing up children in those days - because another woman jumped in front of her husbands horse because of women's rights!!!

Excuse the pun, but people want to take the blinkers off. It was an irresponsible act. So many things could have happened due to her action. She came out a hero; a martyr, but it would have been different if that jockey had died and left a grieving family. As I said above, she could have protested quite effectively in a number of ways. You talk of crazy. well walking in front of a horse to prove a point is crazy, but history has seen it otherwise and Emily Davison has her martydom.

Edited February 8, 2013 by keith lockey

[Maggie/915]

To jump in front of a bus because they have changed the route is crazy. (My opinion)

If you think that equates with Emily's actions,and those are your sincerely held views that is fine.

We live in a democracy where you are free to say and think what you like.

Emily was fighting for that right.

[keith lockey]

To jump in front of a bus because they have changed the route is crazy. (My opinion)

If you think that equates with Emily's actions,and those are your sincerely held views that is fine.

We live in a democracy where you are free to say and think what you like.

Emily was fighting for that right.

That's the point I am trying to make, Maggie, and jumping in front of a horse is crazy - especially when people can get killed or seriuosly injured because of that act.

[Symptoms]

Protest action often ends in a series of unforetold consequences and perhaps those taking part don't always consider extreme outcomes, or maybe they do. However, that cannot ever be allowed to lessen the impact of the cause ... history is crammed with episodes where folks have dared ruling elites only to be met with death or incarceration. Should Martin Niemöller have kept his trap shut knowing he (and his family) would be lifted by the SS; he spoke out and became another hero (with flaws) to millions of us. What about the guys way back who knew they'd get roasted, not by Premiership footballers, but by the agents various churches ... they were prepared to call for change - were they wrong? What about the mucky-faced serfs and peasants in Ye Olde Bedlingtonshire who agitated against their masters for a bit of freedom knowing full well they risked being beheaded (or worse ... having their new brides lifted by the local Lord on the wedding night).

And you know what? It's still going on all over the World. The sight of 'freedom' is such a powerful motivator that folks will go to any length to reach out for it and I for one will always applaud.

[keith lockey]

Protest action often ends in a series of unforetold consequences and perhaps those taking part don't always consider extreme outcomes, or maybe they do. However, that cannot ever be allowed to lessen the impact of the cause ... history is crammed with episodes where folks have dared ruling elites only to be met with death or incarceration. Should Martin Niemöller have kept his trap shut knowing he (and his family) would be lifted by the SS; he spoke out and became another hero (with flaws) to millions of us. What about the guys way back who knew they'd get roasted, not by Premiership footballers, but by the agents various churches ... they were prepared to call for change - were they wrong? What about the mucky-faced serfs and peasants in Ye Olde Bedlingtonshire who agitated against their masters for a bit of freedom knowing full well they risked being beheaded (or worse ... having their new brides lifted by the local Lord on the wedding night).

And you know what? It's still going on all over the World. The sight of 'freedom' is such a powerful motivator that folks will go to any length to reach out for it and I for one will always applaud.

Amen to that, Symptoms.

[Maggie/915]

'Amen' thank 'GOD' Keith you have seen the reason for protest with unforeseen consequences.

[keith lockey]

'Amen' thank 'GOD' Keith you have seen the reason for protest with unforeseen consequences.

No, Maggie, I mean you should never give in to repression or tyranny. I was applauding such actions as Thermopylae, the Alamo or any other stand against suprresive regimes or institutes. In both those cases the ultimate sacrifice was made and they knew what the end result was going to be. But my main argument still holds where Emily Davison is concerned. Jumping in front of a horse is plain silly, no matter what the cause. That jockey could have died and left a grieving family. She should have realised that by her actions. The guy committed suicide years later saying he couldn't forget her face. How many people remember the jockey's name? Make a stand, by all means, but think of the consequences to other people before hand.

Edited February 9, 2013 by keith lockey

[Maggie/915]

You seem like a daily mail reader to me Keith.

I expect you to have the last word but I really do not see your logic and never will.

Best wishes

[tonyg]

good for you

[keith lockey]

You seem like a daily mail reader to me Keith.

I expect you to have the last word but I really do not see your logic and never will.

Best wishes

Daily Mail!!! I wouldn't wipe my **** with that rag. So it just shows how wrong you are about me, Maggie.

But what logic can you not see. All I am saying is jumping in front of a horse is downright crazy. She could have done lots of other things at the race meeting that day to prove her point. I can only reiterate my argument - what if that jockey had died and left a family to grieve. What part of that 'logic' do you not understand?

[Maggie/915]

Check out all that is going on today for International Women's Day.

There are many other talks and activities before June's Anniversary of Emily's death

Morpeth is going to decorate the town in the colours of the suffragettes.

A Lawless Lass.

[Keith Scantlebury]

I'm afraid I am with Keith L on this one. This was a well educated woman (London and Oxford Universities) who decided to use her expensive education to cause disruption, she was a socialite of the time with a criminal record that would not look out of place in the run down inner city or dock areas. She was a militant activist who had would disregard the safety and well being of others just to get noticed. She was just as familiar with the inside of places like strangeways jail as she was with the corridors of Oxford University. Her plan to stick a flag on the kings horse as it was going full pelt on Epsom racecourse is beyond belief. She fully intended to do the horse and (or) jockey some real harm that day, its hard to believe otherwise. Whether she intended to take her own life is debateable, but totaly believeable. (return tickets and ball tickets or not ) If anyone does this today they would (I imagine) be charged with trespass and endangering lives and property. Had she survived the incident she would have no doubt gone to jail AGAIN. She was a poor little rich girl with too much time and money on her hands.